Alternate Perceptions Magazine online, #77, March 2004

Interview with Allen H. Greenfield

by Brent Raynes

Allen H. Greenfield has been a serious investigator and student of UFO and metaphysical mysteries for many years now. To get an overview of his theories, activities and published works visit his website: http://www.mindsping.com/~hellfire/bishop/ There you will find details on how to order two of his recently published books, The Compleat Rite of Memphis, and The Story of the Hermetic Brotherhood of Light. For a preview of his latest book, for which he is still looking for a publisher, check out: http://www.mindspring.com/~hellfire/salvation

Entitled Initiation and Grace: Christ, Crowley and The Dawn of a New Age, this work clearly reflects the depths to which Greenfield examines spiritual reality. In addition, another website explores Greenfield’s family background at: http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.com/~mishpaka/greenfield/

Editor: For sometime now, you’ve had the reputation in ufology of being a deeply complex kind of philosophical thinker. In fact, you’ve been described as a student of esoteric spirituality going all the way back to 1960. As for your UFO interests, you were one of the early organizers of the National UFO Congress back in 1963-64, and knew and worked with many of the well-known figures of that early era like Gray Barker, Jim Moseley, John Keel, Timothy Green Beckley, and many, many others.

Allen Greenfield: 1960 was indeed a banner year for my interests. I joined the late but unlamented NICAP, which survived on the X-Files show into this century but was long gone in the last, the Science Fiction Book Club, got politically active, joined the Mystic Arts book society, all that year. The interest areas­metaphysics or occultism, science fiction or futurism, ufology, politics all--as active interests, date from then. I made it a point to meet people who knew­or seemed to know­something about these areas in the years thereafter, and, with my extensive world travels, got quite an education.

Editor: I was just going over old copies you edited and published back in 1970-71 of the ALTERNATE HORIZONS NEWSLETTER and THE PARAUFOLOGIST, and later in 1976-77, UFOLOGY NOTEBOOK. I came upon an interview done with you back in 1976, and in it you were questioned about your controversial “subjective theory” and your philosophizing along Jungian and complex psychological lines. You described yourself then as a “social revolutionary” as well as an “advocate of nature-oriented, symbolic magickal religious practice.” In fact, that statement seems very similar to your more recent and updated website entry that reflects your stance on UFOs being a “‘signal’ from the Collective Unconscious” where “neglect” of “magical spirituality” causes deep-rooted problems within our society.

Allen Greenfield: I originally subscribed to the ET hypothesis. I don’t discount it now. But by the late ‘60s I came to realize ufology was a branch of an old and complex broader tradition, and nothing I have discovered since makes me think otherwise. I was a kid when I did Alternate Horizons, and the prose could use a lot of work, but it was on the right track. The Paraufologist and UFOlogy Notebook I remain very proud of. For their time, they did what was needed, and my web site and books are today’s descendent. I reach far more people now.

Editor: You certainly seem to be continuing on a similar footpath judging from your website, and your current title as Gnostic Bishop and your lecture appearances at national gatherings of the Gnostic Catholic Church, or the Ordo Templi Orientis (OTO).

Allen Greenfield: Well, I try to keep these interests in separate pockets. Ufologists are okay with it, but some leading occultists have the­to me­absurd idea that ufology is less “respectable” than occultism. Actually, ufology is less controversial, and the two have so many parallels it is staggering.

Editor: Can you please give us something of an update and overview here of your controversial theories, of where you are now, and how your standpoint may have evolved since 1977, and some explanation also of what the O.T.O. is about?

Allen Greenfield: The biggest discovery for me since the late ‘70s was that a Qaballa­often erroneously described as ‘numerology’ ( which it isn’t) discovered by modern occultists for occult use, when applied to certain mysteries in ufology, answer those mysteries and, in a way, make UFO cases­particularly close encounter cases­predictable. This may have more to do with synchronicity and some cutting-edge physics theories than with plans, or it may indicate intelligent design. But, at least, I’ve hit on something that can be tested.

Editor: Sounds very interesting. Please give us an example of how the ancient Qaballa could make UFO close encounter cases predictable, and how readers can find out more on this subject?

Allen Greenfield: Well, my own book, SECRET CIPHER OF THE UFONAUTS is out of print and something of an underground cult classic at this point, but one can usually pick up a copy through Amazon.com new or used, at a reasonable price. There is, I understand, a new book in the same direction coming out from BSRA later this year which incorporates some of my research, and, to get an idea of how Qabala applies here, one might try reading my friend Gerald del Campo’s New Aeon English Qabalah Revealed from Luxor Press. The latter is definitely not a UFO book, but if you learn the system, apply it to “strange names” in UFO lore (like “Orthon” or “Kazik,” for example) one is likely to hit on some remarkable results.

Editor: Could you also elaborate some on the parallels you see between ufology and the occult?

Allen Greenfield: Albert K. Bender set up his room as an occult temple in effect, and three men in black came knocking at his door, beginning a whole era in ufology. UFO beings are described in terms very much like the “fairy folk” of traditional occult lore. Historical myths are filled with legends of beings from the sky that come to Earth to teach wisdom in the same manner as the contactee lore. UFO “trance channeling” is identical to occult “automatic writing” or psychical mediumship. Abductions by the classical elves and such are very similar to UFO abductions. I could go on, but I think this makes the point.

Editor: I guess the next question that naturally evolves from the recognizing of the similarities between UFO encounters and entities of today and the mythic, fairy lore and occult traditions and tales of yesteryear is WHY? Why do you think that all of this is happening, and keeps happening?

Allen Greenfield: The answer is complex, but can be reduced to three elements. First, it is an indication that these mythologies­in the original sense of the term­are likely of the same origin and have the same explanation, varied only by cultural consensus perceptions. Second, it indicates that there is a psychological element that transcends both cultures and historical periods that the phenomenon­singular­has long spoken to and continues to speak to. Third, I would suspect, it suggests that in some ill-defined sense, the phenomenon has an agenda of its own that it adapts to the percipient.

Editor: You’re also a futurist? With fairly accurate predictions, I understand. Can you elaborate on this for us and perhaps what insights this has given you?

Allen Greenfield: I have to qualify this. I am a futurist, not a supernatural prognosticator. That is, I’ve got a good track record of looking at the ‘now’ and accurately projecting where a given thing or trend is heading. In the ‘80s, for example, I predicted the collapse of the Soviet Union and the direct link to the rise of an aggressive Islamist jihad which would threaten the essential fabric of Western Civilization in the 21st Century. I have correctly predicted a year in advance or more every U.S. Presidential election since 1960 without error. I base such predictions on my assessment of the present facts, including obscure facts, and on trends. I publish some of these predictions, but in certain cases I hold them back.